[list-cumbria] list-cumbria Digest, Vol 6, Issue 1

Sun May 5 14:23:41 UTC 2024

Many thanks for the replies about "Barf Syke" that is now called Barfs Sike. The side-by-side map was particularly helpful because it showed the relationship between Barfs Quarries and Barf Sike on opposite sides of the railroad tracks. Also, in the 1841 census Thomas Lancaster is an agricultural laborer, enumerated at a place called “Bonney” [Bonny] in Moresby Parish. I found that farm online awhile ago, but the side-by-side map better shows its location and surrounds.

I had found the old gazetteer webpage, but couldn't make sense of the coordinate information, and the book Quarrying in Cumbria was new to me. I was able to find the book at a library here in the USA and I have requested it through Inter Library Loan. I have since looked in Apple Maps to find the current roundabout and there is a Barfs Road very nearby to the southwest.

Interestingly the 1871 census enumerates six families at "Barf Sike," including one with a nine-year-old boy named Fletcher Nicholson. I'll need to investigate that family now to see whether or not there is any connection to my Fletcher ancestors.

Sincerely,
Stephen Fletcher

-----Original Message-----
From: <list-cumbria at list.cumbriafhs.com>
Sent: May 1, 2024 7:09 AM
To: <list-cumbria at list.cumbriafhs.com>
Subject: list-cumbria Digest, Vol 6, Issue 1

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Today's Topics:

1. Where and what is Barf Syke (Stephen J. Fletcher)
2. Re: Where and what is Barf Syke (Petra Mitchinson)
3. Re: Where and what is Barf Syke (Nev Ramsden)
4. Re: Where and what is Barf Syke (Russ Hogg)
5. Carlisle Patriot, 17 Jan 1824 - Cumberland Sessions (6)
(Petra Mitchinson)

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Message: 1
Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2024 13:00:17 +0000
From: "Stephen J. Fletcher"
To: list-cumbria at list.cumbriafhs.com
Subject: [list-cumbria] Where and what is Barf Syke
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8

Yesterday I ordered the GRO image of the birth registration for my 2x great grandmother, Hannah Lancaster. The second box be birth date reads (with forward slashes I added to indicate line breaks), "Third of / October, / 1839, at / Barf Syke / Distington."

I live in the United States and do not know Distington's geography, so I turned to the Web to determine where that might be (or have been). I discovered Barf, the Lake District fell, and learned that the word sike or syke means ravine, but Google Earth, etc., etc., were no help with the place name.

Would someone on this list know where Barf Syke is (or was) located?

Hopefully and with thanks,
Stephen Fletcher

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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2024 15:56:09 +0100
From: "Petra Mitchinson"
To: "'Genealogy email list for Cumbria'"

Subject: Re: [list-cumbria] Where and what is Barf Syke
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Seems it was called Barfs Sike.

The Old Cumbria Gazetteer is a good help for obscure place names. https://www.lakesguides.co.uk/html/lgaz/lgazfram.htm

They give the coordinates for Barfs Sike as NY00902405. That's next to the big Distington roundabout, between the A595 and the
B5306. Barfs Sike is no longer there, at least not on Streetmap or Googlemaps. You could try one of the old map websites.

Petra

-----Original Message-----
From: list-cumbria [mailto:list-cumbria-bounces at list.cumbriafhs.com] On Behalf Of Stephen J. Fletcher via list-cumbria
Sent: 30 April 2024 14:00
To: list-cumbria at list.cumbriafhs.com
Cc: Stephen J. Fletcher
Subject: [list-cumbria] Where and what is Barf Syke

Yesterday I ordered the GRO image of the birth registration for my 2x great grandmother, Hannah Lancaster. The second box be birth
date reads (with forward slashes I added to indicate line breaks), "Third of / October, / 1839, at / Barf Syke / Distington."

I live in the United States and do not know Distington's geography, so I turned to the Web to determine where that might be (or have
been). I discovered Barf, the Lake District fell, and learned that the word sike or syke means ravine, but Google Earth, etc., etc.,
were no help with the place name.

Would someone on this list know where Barf Syke is (or was) located?

Hopefully and with thanks,
Stephen Fletcher

------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2024 16:24:26 +0100
From: "Nev Ramsden"
To: "Genealogy email list for Cumbria"

Subject: Re: [list-cumbria] Where and what is Barf Syke
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original

Barfs at Distington was the site of a Limestone Quarry developed for the
Iron & Steel industry. Find Petras NGR reference on a first or second series
Ordnance Survey map which can be found on the Web

Nev.Ramsden

-----Original Message-----
From: Petra Mitchinson via list-cumbria
Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2024 3:56 PM
To: 'Genealogy email list for Cumbria'
Cc: Petra Mitchinson
Subject: Re: [list-cumbria] Where and what is Barf Syke

Seems it was called Barfs Sike.

The Old Cumbria Gazetteer is a good help for obscure place names.
https://www.lakesguides.co.uk/html/lgaz/lgazfram.htm

They give the coordinates for Barfs Sike as NY00902405. That's next to the
big Distington roundabout, between the A595 and the
B5306. Barfs Sike is no longer there, at least not on Streetmap or
Googlemaps. You could try one of the old map websites.

Petra

-----Original Message-----
From: list-cumbria [mailto:list-cumbria-bounces at list.cumbriafhs.com] On
Behalf Of Stephen J. Fletcher via list-cumbria
Sent: 30 April 2024 14:00
To: list-cumbria at list.cumbriafhs.com
Cc: Stephen J. Fletcher
Subject: [list-cumbria] Where and what is Barf Syke

Yesterday I ordered the GRO image of the birth registration for my 2x great
grandmother, Hannah Lancaster. The second box be birth
date reads (with forward slashes I added to indicate line breaks), "Third of
/ October, / 1839, at / Barf Syke / Distington."

I live in the United States and do not know Distington's geography, so I
turned to the Web to determine where that might be (or have
been). I discovered Barf, the Lake District fell, and learned that the word
sike or syke means ravine, but Google Earth, etc., etc.,
were no help with the place name.

Would someone on this list know where Barf Syke is (or was) located?

Hopefully and with thanks,
Stephen Fletcher

------------------------------------
This mailing list is run by Cumbria Family History Society for the benefit
of the general public. For further information, or for terms and conditions
and a privacy statement please go to www.cumbriafhs.com/maillist

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------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2024 18:07:02 +0000
From: Russ Hogg
To: Genealogy email list for Cumbria

Subject: Re: [list-cumbria] Where and what is Barf Syke
Message-ID:

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

>They give the coordinates for Barfs Sike as NY00902405. That's next to the big Distington roundabout, between the A595 and the
>B5306. Barfs Sike is no longer there, at least not on Streetmap or Googlemaps. You could try one of the old map websites.
>
>Petra

Stephen,

Here is a link to Barfs Sike on the National Library of Scotland's website:

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by-side/#zoom=17.0&lat=54.60184&lon=-3.53631&layers=6&right=ESRIWorld
Side by side georeferenced maps viewer - Map images - National Library of Scotland
Compare georeferenced historic maps in a split-screen viewer side-by-side with other map layers
maps.nls.uk
Regards,

Russ

[https://s-install.avcdn.net/ipm/preview/icons/icon-envelope-tick-green-avg-v1.png] Virus-free.www.avg.com
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Message: 5
Date: Wed, 1 May 2024 12:08:08 +0100
From: "Petra Mitchinson"
To: "CUL Google Group"
Cc: "Cumbria Mailing List \(CFHS\)"
Subject: [list-cumbria] Carlisle Patriot, 17 Jan 1824 - Cumberland
Sessions (6)
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Saturday 17 Jan 1824 (p. 2, col. 5 - p. 3, col. 3)

CUMBERLAND SESSIONS.

Wednesday, Jan. 14.

[continued]

John TAYLOR, and Isabella TAYLOR, his wife, of the parish of Caldbeck, charged with stealing, on the 20th of September, four tame
and reclaimed Geese, the properly of Isaac HOLMES, pleaded Not Guilty.

Mr. AGLIONBY was counsel for the prosecution. The geese were stolen from Warnell fell, on or about the 26th August, and were not
found till the 20th of September. Part of the evidence on which the prisoners were committed, was the confession of the wife, which
would not now be put in.

Isaac HOLMES-I live at Caldbeck, and prisoners resided within a quarter of a mile of me. In August last, I had seven young geese and
some old ones. The former I had brought up myself; they fed out of my hand, so that I knew them well; I marked them in the outer web
of the near foot, and the near web of the outer foot-and one of them, moreover, had a broken wing. These geese were going on
Warnell-fell. I put them there before the Carlisle August fair. I saw them on the fell on the 16th September-afterwards six of the
young ones were gone. I first met with four of them again a week before Martinmas, beside Ireby mill, in the possession of Thomas
CROOKDAKE, miller; I knew them immediately-examined them, and found them marked as described; and one had a broken wing. I can swear
to them positively. I afterwards took them home. The others I never again saw.

The male prisoner-Did you ever see me near your geese? Answer, No. Can you prove that I did steal them?-This required no answer.

Thomas CROOKDAKE, miller, of Ireby mill.-The last witness had the four geese of me. I bought them of a woman who called herself John
TAYLOR's wife, but I did not know her again till she confessed herself to be the person before the Magistrate. She brought five, and
told me they were geese that my son and her husband had talked about, the latter promising to give 2s. each for them. One of them
had a broken wing. She brought them in either August or September; the fifth goose died. When she came with them, they were poor
little things; so much so, that I refused to take them. She said she could not drive them back. I told her to turn them on the green
before the door. I said I would give her 5s. for them if they lived-and I paid her part in meal and flour. Afterwards TAYLOR himself
came and insisted on having 2s. each, as he had agreed with my son: but I did not pay him any more. He came a second time and saw
them, and spoke of them as his. He lived about four miles off.

Prisoner-Did I ever ask you for any thing for the geese? Witness: Yes. Pris. I never did, Thomas.

Joseph CROOKDAKE, son of the last witness-John TAYLOR applied to me about selling geese; he said he had two, and asked 2s. 3d. each
for them. I replied that I would give 2s. each if they were as big as several others before the door; he said he would bring them
himself. Some were brought. About ten days after, TAYLOR came to the mill, and requested more pay for the five geese that his wife
had left; I weighed him two stone of meal as part payment; and he observed that 6d. more was due.

Prisoner-I asked for two stone of meal on credit, and you said you would not trust me, as your father was not at home.

Witness-That is not true.

In defence of himself, TAYLOR declared that he had no concern in the transaction. His wife asserted the same thing-"He was not at
home; it was I who took the geese." They called no witnesses to character.

The Jury found both prisoners Guilty.-John TAYLOR, transported seven years. Isabella TAYLOR, twelve months' imprisonment, and hard
labour.

[to be continued]

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